Shocking: Windows 98 & XP Are Still Being Taught in Pakistani Schools

Federal and provincial governments are making claims of digitizing Pakistan and what not. All of this is good and some initiatives certainly do seem to signal at some interesting times ahead.

But there’s massive room for improvement. We are living in the 21st century after all, which is why there are certain things that are inexcusable in this day and age.

Our children need to be kept updated about new technologies from a younger age. That much no one has any qualms about, be it parents, policymakers and other stakeholders in the system. But when you take a look at the grass root level, where the mindset for the upcoming digital generation has to be developed, you see an educational system that is atrociously outdated.

How atrociously outdated are we talking about here? Well, for starters, adults would find it shocking that in this day and age, most Pakistani government and private schools either don’t consider computing a necessary subject worth teaching or teach kids courses that were relevant at least two decades ago.

Modern Schools Teaching Outdated Courses

Whether its private schools looting the public with outrageous fees or public schools claiming titles like ‘Smart’ and ‘modern’, Pakistani schools are teaching courses which became outdated during the pre-2000 era.

Computing as a subject for young students in most government schools is almost a no go. However, private schools which do offer the subject are digitally ancient. How ancient exactly you say? Even in this day and age, where Windows 10 is nearly two years old, those which do offer computing as a subject are basing their courses on Windows XP or even Windows 98!

It is common knowledge that most public schools don’t offer computer studies as a subject up until a student reaches Class VI. When they do start, students are taught age-old stuff based on Windows XP.

While some elite class private schools have decent computers with relatively updated operating systems which launched within the past decade, most private schools have outdated PCs running Windows XP.

Many commenters will say that there’s nothing wrong with running PCs with a decade or so old Operating Systems (owing to high license costs, exponential IT fees, etc.), but the truth of the matter is that these old OSes tend to incur a huge human as well as financial costs in hindsight. After all, the OSes of today boast better security and compatibility than Windows XP, which if you remember, was mired with viruses and was slated as “officially dead” by Microsoft.

Keeping Up With The Pace

When compared to other fields, computer technology and IT have been growing so rapidly that a decade’s worth of progress is made in just a year. You just can’t afford to sit back and let others pass you by.

As Pakistani schools continue to offer courses based on Windows XP or 98 – a 16 to 19 years old operating system mind you – and carry on using/teaching about extinct tech like floppy disks, CRT Monitors, magnetic tape disks and what not, the next generation becomes more distant to the current world of computing.

Not only is it problematic for the students during that stage of their life, but they have to overcome a huge knowledge barrier when they take computer studies related courses in universities which require them to be up to date with the latest trends in the field.

Google and Microsoft have been trying to introduce coding and latest technologies amongst the youth of Pakistan. What does this neanderthal approach to computing by Pakistani educational institutions contribute to?

Final Words

With the increasing usage of laptops and PCs among children, it places a huge burden on the current education system’s shoulders to educate the youth on the subject. We often see experts debate on educating the public on the proper use of internet, computers and other smart gadgets. If kids are not taught about the proper use of technology and developments in the field, Pakistani youth will never be able to reach their true potential.

Now the government needs to fix the educational system, update computer related courses and make it a compulsory subject during initial studies so that every Pakistani child has a basic understanding of the field when they grow up. This will also help in improving the students’ abilities when they start higher studies as they would be better prepared to deal with the latest requirements of the digital and connected era.

He is the Editor at ProPakistani.


  • Raja G

    In a country where 8000 madrasaas are for poor people who cares what digital education is for the elite an middle class kids . And there is no harm teaching windows XP and 98 – Even Dos should be taught that can help kids to learn batch programming – Gentelman first fix the Education systems that are running in Pakistan from Public to private sector for elite class to madrassas every education system is going towards opposite direction – then comes NGO based english school where no kids knows what is urdu :) and I am also writing this in english :)

    • continuedhere

      But the nuclear program is ok right? 44% of all children are out of school but it’s ok to spend so much on defence right?

      • Raja G

        yes even we have to eat grass this program have to continue – koe or takleef ? we cannot allow india to demolish pakistan – do read bajpae statements after indian nuclear tests – with his sword what he was saying in parliment to pakistan – and when we responded swiftly on 28th he was about to fall on ground with shame- without deterence we cannot survive with india bro

        • Hafiz Abdul Basit BJ

          haan India se lar lar kr dekho kaha pohonch gae hum :P

        • Shahid Saleem

          ok, we have nuclear program and lots and lots and lots of nukes. can we stop making nukes now and focus on education?

          it is not as if we are using nuclear bombs anywhere so why do we need to keep making more? do they expire after some time?

          • Raja G

            Bother its called nuclear deterrence we have to be ready for any sort of nuclear threat india raises for . With Power balance on both sides it also helped in keeping low Risk of War as both countries knows consequences of Starting nuclear war.Education is important indeed but without protection from borders on air we live with peace . when India is continuously develop increasing budget for defense to aggressively work on arm race we are left with investing more on deter the threat – like Missile competition every year both countries are conducting tests of Missiles to beat each other in technology- Intercontinental missiles keeps USA quite against North Korea whenever North korea warn USA to keep your mouth shut we have intercontinental missiles then comes American duplimates soft responses- this is the way nations are surviving when any enemy tires to plan any attack on your soil. Pakistan is forced to work this way – In 70s India did first nuclear tests and throughout yeard created sense of wat ar was imminent. It was only Baj Pae who provided Pakistan chance to conduct swift reply when e openly threaten Pakistan by raising Sword in parliament that we will destroy Pakistan now with ease.

            • Shahid Saleem

              We have more than enough nukes to destroy all of India’s cities twice over. That is how many we have (estimated). Yet, we are still making more. We don’t need more, we need education (sorry pink floyd)

              • Raja G

                which education need this country there are 6-7 education systems are running in this country ?

                • Shahid Saleem

                  Let’s start with the one that can take cares of the crores of Pakistani children who are not in school today.

    • Geek At Large

      Madarsas are an assembly line of producing illiterate extremist mullahs who have no idea of modern day world and are nothing but a burden on the economy as they can’t contribute or be productive.

      • continuedhere

        they contribute by fighting against india. it is the government’s policy to breed these mullahs so that they provide the idealogical basis for the jihadis. these jihadis are then deployed against india where they commit acts of terror against the civilian population.

        • Talal
          • ھیدر

            بہت ساری تالیاں آپ کے لیے، اتنی سنہری بات کی ہے کہ دل خہش ہو گیا ۔ اگر کچہ کام کی بات کرنی ہو تو لکہیے ورنہ بکواس کرنے سے گریز کریں، شکریہ۔

            • Talal

              “ھیدر” نامی لبرل منےایسی عبرت
              ناک اردو لکھنا تو نے کہاں سے سیکھی تھی؟

              • Marium

                Road pe to ‘kutia’ apne huqooq leti hai?
                Foran hi aurat ko neeche giraane ki to puri koshish rehti hai. Ap jaise khule demaagh ke hazraat ki wajah se hi hamara mulk itna moral aur ethical hai.

                • Talal

                  بی بی عورت کو اس کے کونسے حقوق نہیں مل رہے؟

                  • Marium

                    Ap jaise log jo internet ki anonymity ke peeche aurto ko gaaliyan dete hai agar ap bhi thori tameez se behas karna seekh lein to bht improvement hai.

                    • Talal

                      میں کوئی گمنام نہیں.میں اپنا نام پروفائل پر استعمال کر رہا ہوں اور فیمینسٹ لبرل عورتیں مجھے پسند نہیں جو مردوں کو دو ٹکے کا حقوق سلب کرنے والے سمجھتی ہیں

                • Shahid Saleem

                  he is not really anonymous. he is Contact.Talal1 on facebook and contact.talal at gmail.

                  maybe 0313-654-3221, i haven’t tried.

                  not a very honest business (his sites) i think but that’s just my opinion. you can find traces of him if you google for “lazy sapper”

                  LOL he changed his name on posts but not his profile photo, very easy to trace.

                  • Talal

                    As I said I am not an anonymous.
                    and my Gmail got my photo id too.

                    • Shahid Saleem

                      and yet trying to take your info off the net…

                    • Talal

                      Why would I?
                      The name Lazy Sapper was not good. So I changed it. In fact, I am now more visible than before.
                      And yes I do hide my email and contact number to avoid spammers.
                      So you got problem with that you “Aamir Liaqat” type religious scholar?

                    • Shahid Saleem

                      Can you insult me and other Muslims some more please
                      I’m SUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUURE it will get you to heaven.

                    • Salman Akram

                      Bhai thori piya kr so that you may remain sensible…Talal has not insulted anyone here…If you can’t bear the truth just leave the discussion and live by your dream of modernizing (Liberalizing) the Islam. But whatever you do, you can never change the originality of Islam..Its GOD’s promise

                    • Shahid Saleem

                      are you blind? he has insulted females.

          • Geek At Large

            So your point is if someone comes out on the street for their rights they’re not human beings but dogs?

            • Talal

              What rights?

              • Geek At Large

                It doesn’t matter what rights. Protesting in itself is a democratic right of every citizen irrespective of their gender.

            • Talal

              Is your mother or sister missing any rights? Since it’s about women rights?

              • Geek At Large

                All women are missing many rights in Pakistan including my mother and sisters. We’re entrapped in a misogynistic and patriarchal culture where men dictate the terms and women are treated as lesser human beings. 1000 women are killed in Pakistan every year for marrying someone they love.

                • Talal

                  Dum dum domestic violence is the highest in america.
                  Boyfriends kill their girlfriends or beat them for making out with someone else.

                  And islam raises standards of woman. I love and respect mehram ladies of my family. My mother can dictate me what to do and what not to do.

                  A daughter should listen to his father and wife should listen to his husband. Too bad working for some “american” company you have lost your senses, your moral values and your deen.

                  • Geek At Large

                    “Dum dum domestic violence is the highest in America.”

                    Did I say that domestic violence doesn’t exist in the US? And if something bad happens in the US it is okay to do it in Pakistan? How does that add up at all?

                    “And islam raises standards of woman. I love and respect mehram ladies of my family. My mother can dictate me what to do and what not to do.”

                    I disagree with the first sentence. Islam considers women to be second grade citizens. And you only respect ladies who act according to your beliefs. If a lady disagrees with you, you call them a bitch.

                    “A daughter should listen to his father and wife should listen to his husband. Too bad working for some “american” company you have lost your senses, your moral values and your deen. ”

                    No she shouldn’t. A girl is a human being first and then something else. She has every right to follow her hopes, dreams and feelings as men do. My morality doesn’t come from religion. What someone does with their genitals is none of my business.

                    • Talal

                      I argue with chimpanzee descendant like you almost daily on fb. Atheists are pure sc*m on earth with no values, nothing.

                      Calling woman a b*tch is a common slang in west. All dirty slangs point to woman one way or other.

                      What if by mistake you get a daughter and she does not listen to you. Run away with a sc*mbag. Start working as a ho*ker? How would you feel? I suspect you won’t feel anything because you are an atheist and you got no moral values

                      “my body; my right” non sense

                    • Geek At Large

                      Well having a debate is always good but it should be done with an open mind. You don’t seem to have one though. You’re quick to badmouth people who don’t agree with you.

                      “Atheists are pure sc*m on earth with no values, nothing.”

                      If your morals only exist because of the fear of an imaginary being in the sky watching you all the time, then they are not really morals. It’s fear. I’m not an atheist but atheists usually have stronger morals because they don’t consider themselves answerable to any religion or god.

                      I don’t do the right thing because god will punish me if I don’t. I do the right thing purely because I’m a good person.

                      “Calling woman a b*tch is a common slang in west. All dirty slangs point to woman one way or other.”

                      If something wrong happens in the West, it doesn’t mean it is fine to do it in Pakistan. And we should abolish all those dirty slangs.

                      “What if by mistake you get a daughter and she does not listen to you. Run away with a sc*mbag.”

                      People make mistakes. If my daughter wants to marry a scumbag, I’d give advise but I will not force her to marry someone else. If her marriage works out, fantastic. If it doesn’t work out, I’ll support her. That’s how it should be.

                      “Start working as a ho*ker? How would you feel? I suspect you won’t feel anything because you are an atheist and you got no moral values”

                      Again, I’d give her advise. But I won’t force her to do something that she doesn’t want to do. I feel sad for girls who sell their bodies even if they are not related to me. So yeah, I’d be sad for my daughter but again I won’t force my choices on her.

                      “”my body; my right”

                      Every human being has a sovereign right to their body. That’s not nonsense, that’s very rational.

                    • Talal

                      Seems like you have never been to Atheists parade and what they do in their spare times. When you got no religion, you got no values. https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/99ecbba6ac6b7341243578b4b7ab01ef2645680a8872009307c1dad68d454252.jpg

                    • Talal
                    • Geek At Large

                      Who are they hurting? Are they blowing themselves up with bombs strapped on their chest?

                      If religion gives you morals why are you calling people dogs, scumbags and bitches? And while according to you I’ve no morals, I’ve been civilized throughout this thread. Or calling people dogs and scumbags is moral?

                    • Talal

                      because some people are s*umbag. My religious values teach me to not f*ck my mother and sister. What values have you got that would stop you from doing it?

                    • Geek At Large

                      Well, it’s genetically and medically harmful to have sex with immediate relatives. Including cousins.

                    • Geek At Large

                      “وصیت لکھ کر رکھ جا کہ مرنے کے بعد کوئی ملا تیرا جنازہ نہ پڑھائے. تجھے کسی ویرانے میں پھینک دیں جہاں کوے گدھ اور کتے تجھے کھا جائیں”

                      Look if you think that this is moral then fine. I won’t argue.

                      And sleeping with immediate relatives is medically harmful. It creates lots of complexities. Including cousins.

                    • Talal

                      Talk about p*mping your own mother. What would stop you? Science? What values do the science give you? Does it teach you to respect your father?

                    • Salman Akram

                      When you don’t have any morals you don’t mind anything so you remain CALM.. But when you have morals wrong things make you angry and when you are angry you use these kind of words.

                    • Geek At Large

                      That’s actually have nothing to do with morals, it’s your temperament. Wrong things make me angry too like murder and rape. But if someone has a different opinion or different religion than mine, it doesn’t make me angry. Because that’s not wrong.

                    • Salman Akram

                      “If your morals only exist because of the fear of an imaginary being in the sky watching you all the time, then they are not really morals. It’s fear. I’m not an atheist but atheists usually have stronger morals because they don’t consider themselves answerable to any religion or god.”
                      So you are saying if One is not answerable to any God or religion, he has stronger MORALS..OMG you have a damn good logic here bro…CLAPPING for you…Once more CLAPPING for stronger MORALS…

                    • Geek At Large

                      So you are saying if One is not answerable to any God or religion, he has stronger MORALS..OMG you have a damn good logic here bro…CLAPPING for you…Once more CLAPPING for stronger MORALS…

                      Yes, if you stopped being emotional you would actually realize it’s true.

                    • Salman Akram

                      Kakay jb koi jwab na ban paye tau yahi kch reh jata ha.. Chill kr apny stronger morals k sath and one more thing even Animals have more stronger MORALS than you because they are not answerable to anyone…

                    • Shahid Saleem

                      Let me turn it around and ask… are you answerable to Geek At Large? To Talal, Mariam, me, any random commenter on this blog, anyone on the internet, Mark Zuckerberg, Senator Rehman, anyone?

                      Are you answerable to them? No? Then why is Geek answerable to you?

                    • Salman Akram

                      Who said he is answerable to me???? What really??? I was telling him if he does not have a logic then don’t reply back to me.. Don’t you see he has replied to my comment.. WTH just look at the situation before jumping right in..

                    • Marium

                      Why don’t you enlighten us Talal Bhai how to deal with such daughters? What to do with a daughter who doesn’t listen to you and runs away with a sc*mbag?

                    • Talal

                      As a good father i will ground her. No going out.

                      I am sure if a daughter is taught moral and family values from the beginning, she will turn out to be a good person.

                    • Marium

                      But what if she’s already run away? And she’s an adult, you can’t really ground a 25 year old can you?

                    • Talal

                      What if she was born to me, lived 25 years with me, learnt morality from me, she will never rebel against me.

                      And yes i can ground my 25 years old daughter and no body can stop me.

                    • Marium

                      The state can very well stop you since she is an independent adult, not your property or jageerdari -_-

                    • Talal

                      Bullsh*t. Only your feminist crappy NGOs can beat their drums, gather around media and present her oppressed. But who will let them in?

                      My daughters are my property as long as they are not married and i am their caretaker.

                      Don’t need a dictation from feminist.

                    • Marium

                      Wah Talal bhai ap to complete karo kari ke supporter lagte hai. Kahan likha hai Islam mein ke aurtein mard ki property hoti hai?

                    • Talal

                      کارو کاری کیا ہے معلوم بھی ہے؟ کارو کاری کا اسلام سے کوئ تعلق نہیں.
                      بیٹیاں پراپرٹی سے بھی زیادہ قیمتی ہیں.
                      اور قیمتی چیز کو کوئی ضائع کیوں کرے؟
                      دو ٹکے کا کوئی لفنگا آپ کی بیٹی پر نظر رکھے اور آپ کچھ نہ کرو یہ شرافت کی کونسی قسم ہے؟

                    • Marium

                      “بیٹیاں پراپرٹی سے بھی زیادہ قیمتی ہیں.
                      اور قیمتی چیز کو کوئی ضائع کیوں کرے؟”
                      بیٹیوں کو ضائع؟ ابھی بھی آپ ایسے ہی بات کررہے ہیں جیسے کوئ object کی بات ہورہی ہو۔ سوال کا جواب نہیں دیا ویسے آپ نے، اسلام میں کہاں لکھا ہے کہ عورتیں مرد کی ملکیت ہیں؟

                    • Talal

                      نکاح عورت کو مرد کے ساتھ باندھ دیتا ہے. اسے ملکیت سمجھ لو. عورت بھی کہہ سکتی ہے میرا شوہر میری ملکیت ہے.

                    • Talal

                      Now reading your lame arguments i know what kind of woman you are.

                    • Shahid Saleem

                      what can we do with talal’s body?

                    • Salman Akram

                      Bro please jb hosh me ho na tb comment krna…Abay q peetay ho itni jtni snbhal nhi skty??? Discussion ho rhi kya r tera comment…

            • Talal

              Abortion, walking nude on roads, having boyfriends these are not the “women rights”. If these are, ask your mum why didn’t she abort you?

              • Geek At Large

                If these are, ask your mum why didn’t she abort you?

                Because she wanted to have me. If she wanted to abort me, it would have been her choice too. Who am I to dictate that?

                • Talal

                  Stupid. Abortion is murder.

                  Now i am sure since you are an atheist you must believe that you evolved from monkeys and world came into existence from nothing and became perfect on its own. What a great logic you idiots have. Money is your only god.

                  • Geek At Large

                    I’m not an atheist. I’m a deist.

                    World isn’t perfect. You think it is but it isn’t. There are many things wrong with our universe.

                    Abortion isn’t a murder until fetus is developed. Before that it’s just a lump of tissues with no life, consciousness or feelings.

                    • Talal

                      Every developing fetus is going to be a human being but d*mb mothers abort them.

                    • Geek At Large

                      Nope. Not necessarily.

                    • Salman Akram

                      If there have been no God to hold on this world.. You would have been raped and fucked thousands of time by your own liberal dushbags

                    • Geek At Large

                      On average 70,000 rapes are reported every year around the globe. Your argument is extremely flawed.

                    • Salman Akram

                      And yes there are 7,000,000,000 people in this world.. Would you please calculate the percentage? Or should I do it for you? And how many of these 70000 rapes are done by maulvis or students who have been radicalized by Mudrassahs???

                    • Geek At Large

                      You’re changing goal posts. Your argument was if there wasn’t a god there would have been thousands of rapes. I just told you that thousands are rapes are already happening.

                    • Salman Akram

                      Boy its discussion!!! Not a mathematics exam… I am reasoning with logics for which you don’t have a logical answer.. What about my universities comment? Would you say I am changing goal posts for that too?

                    • Muhammed Ovais Alam

                      Arguing with an Atheist is like arguing with a non living thing. When they have no answer they start abusing Madarsaas, Islam and every other thing you love.

                    • Geek At Large

                      I’m not an atheist. And I’ve no hate for Islam. I’m pointing out a real problem that Pakistan faces today. Madarsahs are a root cause of producing extremism and militancy.

                    • Muhammed Ovais Alam

                      When you have NO ‘sane’ answer you ignore questions. Like you did in above thread.

                      This article is NOT about madarsahs.

                    • Geek At Large

                      I know this article isn’t about madarsahs. I replied to OP’s comment who brought up madarsahs.

                    • Geek At Large

                      You’ve constantly changed goal posts jumping from one argument to another. What you call logic is actually tautology. Besides, you seem angry and very emotional which isn’t good for having a rational debate. If you just calm down a bit, relax and think about what I’m trying to say then you might be able to respond in a coherent and rational manner. Your over-reliance on ad-hominem is a big indication that you’re not being rational.

                    • Salman Akram

                      Ab kya kahon? Kakay sarkari school se parha hua hn itni mushkil english nhi aati mjhy jtni tu bol rha ha… Chalo m maan leta hn k m goal posts change kr rha hn (which actually i m not doing) mere university waly comment ka jwab tau dy dy bhai… Ya us k liye b aisi english likh kr jwab dy ga?

                    • Salman Akram

                      Yes who are those rapists? Students of Mudrassahs?? GOD has clearly told in His Book Quran that this world is not perfect. There are ups and downs. Its actually the exam, result of which will be announced on the Judgment Day.

                    • Geek At Large

                      Did I claim that all rapists are mullahs or all 70,000 rapes are done by maulvis?

                      My point was pretty simple. Even with God, there are thousands of rapes happening every year.

          • Khalid Yaldram

            ap na tu la li aj libral ki hahahahahha

        • Raja G

          nae ab aisa bhe nae hai – madrassa jane wale deen ki taleem hasil kerte hai – General Zia ka dor nae hai bhae india jana bund ker dia Mushraf sab nay-

      • Talal

        What have you invented you libtard sc*m?

        • Geek At Large

          I work remotely from Pakistan for an American company so I help bringing in dollars to my country helping the economy. I also pay thousands in taxes annually. Besides that, I teach poor children in my free time.

          So all in all, I’m at least contributing to the society in some way.

          • Talal

            D*mb f*ck what have you invented?

            Working with Adsense or any freelancing platform does not make you a better person. If that does then i am better than mofos like you.

            • Geek At Large

              I don’t understand why are you getting so angry. I neither work with AdSense nor am I a freelancer. Bringing in money from other country does contribute to the economy. And most mullahs don’t do anything besides being muftis and Imams and spreading hatred.

              • Talal

                وصیت لکھ کر رکھ جا کہ مرنے کے بعد کوئی ملا تیرا جنازہ نہ پڑھائے. تجھے کسی ویرانے میں پھینک دیں جہاں کوے گدھ اور کتے تجھے کھا جائیں. ایڈا تو
                contributor of economy.

              • Salman Akram

                Just to inform you that many of the MULLAHS teach Quran online and bring in the money to the economy too.. And that may be more than that you bring in… They have websites which are visited by hundreds if not thousands on daily basis, this too bring in money (Adsense).. If they were not here who would have taught you the Islamic Teachings???

                • Geek At Large

                  People can learn Islam on their own. Religion is a personal matter. The religion these Mullahs teach, with or without money, is one of the major problems. The hate you’ve for me just because I’m not a Muslim is an example of what Mullah teachings have done to this nation.

                  • Salman Akram

                    Of people can learn Islam on their own than they can learn the science and arts and technology on their own too.. So there is no need of universities… Please yar koi aqal wali baat kr.. Kch seekhny k liye insan ko teacher ki zrurt hoti beshak wo professor ho mochi ho Carpenter ho barber ho ya Mullah ho… R agr Mullah nhi hon gy tau namaz kon parhaye ga?? Tu!!!

                    • Shahid Saleem

                      No one said there is no need for Madrassahs. But to deny that there is abuse of students in madrassahs is simply unbelievable. There is abuse of students in public schools. There are moulvis caught every year for abusing children (boys AND girls) in Pakistan. EVERY YEAR. Clearly something should be done about it.

                      Yet guess who resists registering madrassahs and make a big deal of it? Yes, the people who run madrassahs. Why?

                    • Salman Akram

                      I have also acknowledged each and everything you said… I have also said that Mudrassahs must be registered and funded by govt… If you scroll through my comments you will find it.. But it does not only happens in Mudrassahs only.. It happens in universities, schools everywhere… So please stop hitting Mudrassahs only.. All this wrongdoings must be stopped everywhere

                  • Salman Akram

                    R ab ye na keh di k namaz tau insan khud b parh skta ha.. Bhai jb 2 namazi available hon tau jamat krwana zruri ha.. R Imam wo insan ho jo Imamat k kabil b ho.. Ab ye na keh di k Mullah tau imamat k kabil nhi..

                    • Shahid Saleem

                      listen, your advice might be true for PAKISTAN but what about millions of Muslims who live outside Muslim countries? They don’t learn prayer from madrassahs. They DO learn from parents. They DO learn from other Muslims. Even if they only have interactions with scholars on Youtube or Paltalk. Here we have a practical example of people who DO learn Islam

                      They DO NOT rely on formal schooling to learn Islam. It is NOT a requirement.

                    • Salman Akram

                      Bhai universities bhi close kr do.. We can learn from parents. Friends.. And about the muslims living in non Muslim countries they do have mosques there and yes these mosques too have Imams..

              • Muhammed Ovais Alam

                and you quoted ‘Mullahs’ out of nowhere. No ONE was comparing you with them.
                WTF you are quoting them again & again?

          • Talal

            Besides i can prove it to you that many mullahs are making more money than you. So if ‘making money’ makes someone productive then those “mullahs” are more “productive” than you

            • Virajpai

              What brilliant logic –
              1. You only contribute to economy if you invent something.
              2. But madressahs also don’t invent anything – but according to my logic you can’t say anything to them otherwise you will be a libtard.
              3. If you contribute to economy through freelancing, it doesn’t make you a better person. But if it does, than I am better. But I am not better because I just said it doesn’t make you better.
              4. Ergo I am not better but I will school you on morals.
              5. And even if earning money is a sign of productivity, than mullahs are more productive because they earn more. But since I don’t think more money is more productivity than they aren’t really better than you.

              Do you see how many holes there are in your chain of reasoning? What were you even arguing about again!?

              • Talal

                Wajpai, Tu bta tu konsa productive kaam karta h jo tere ko mardarsey ka naam suntey hi kharish lag gai?

                • Marium

                  Why don’t you tell us what makes you so qualified jo itna moral high ground lia hua hai? Ap ne aisa Kia Kia Hai?
                  Waise Virajpai really split up your whole argument open – it’s funny how you couldn’t even reply to a single point.

              • Salman Akram

                Kehna kya chahta ha bhai??? None of your single statement makes sense

            • Geek At Large

              Yeah, may be 3 out of 100. And those mullahs usually have a background in modern education.

              • Salman Akram

                Yeah just like 3 out of 100 citizen in this country are earning some money from abroad so everyone other than them is dysfunctional citizen.

                • Geek At Large

                  Earning from abroad isn’t the only criteria to be a contributing citizen. Someone working in Pakistan for a Pakistani company is also a contributor. Mullahs from madarsas only become Imam or mufti and spread hatred through mosques.

                  • Salman Akram

                    Yr lgta ha tu blind ha.. Ya jb Mullah samny atay hain tau teri eyesight ghaib ho jati ha.. Market m ja kr dkh ktny Mullah business kr rhy hain bthy r ktny jobs kr rhy hain.. Junaid Jamshaid b mullah e tha na.. Please yr ab koi chawal na mari

          • Khawaja Atteeq

            Geek you are arguing with a low life pig who’s answer will always be WEST WEST WEST.

            • Salman Akram

              Thank you High Life PIG…

          • Muhammed Ovais Alam

            So Did I (Alhamdullilah) and a number of Pakistanis.
            Does it give you the right to abuse anyone you want?

            • Shahid Saleem

              Geek at Large has not abused anyone. Please look at his comments and copy/paste the words or phrases where he has abused anyone who has posted or commented here.

              Not a single person.

              Yet Talal and you cannot seem to go a day without abusing people. And then you think your abuse will get you to heaven?

              • Muhammed Ovais Alam

                Do you mind replying to only those comments where you’re quoted? Is it difficult to mind your own business?

                If not, could you state a single comment of mine where I abused anyone (except those Aholes who abuses the religion)? and I never said that abusing someone will give you any reward let alone the heaven.
                I NEVER KNEW THAT YOU CAN READ PEOPLE’S MIND.

                Are you taking drugs again? If not then how do you know what I am thinking?

                • Shahid Saleem

                  — Do you mind replying to only those comments where you’re quoted? Is it difficult to mind your own business?

                  You are asking me to do what you will not do. Keep that in mind. Next, what is or what is not my business is not for you to decide, especially when I am commenting on a blog run by someone else. It’s not your “house” or my “house” and you are as welcome as me here. Unless the owner says otherwise, of course.

                  It is funny that you say “I NEVER KNEW THAT YOU CAN READ PEOPLE’S MIND.”

                  But the thing is, you are abusing people without knowing what is in their hearts. Obvious example, just from this page:

                  “Arguing with an Atheist is like arguing with a non living thing.” in response to Geek At Large. How did you decide that he was a kaffir? What are you implying if not openly saying?

                  And why did you decide that it was easier to dismiss him as an atheist than engage him and convince him of the Truth? Whatever that “why” reason is, is where you have practically given up on him.

                  Learn to be patient.

                  • Muhammed Ovais Alam

                    I am still waiting for that ‘you abuse in all comments’ reference.

                    I NEVER said that don’t come here or don’t spread your hate here. You are FREE to do whatever you want. I SAID (ghour se parh lo)

                    Do you mind replying to only those comments where you’re quoted? Is it difficult to mind your own business?

                    I specifically quoted GAL and you jumped into the comments instead of him.
                    Bohat hi koi farigh admi ho bhai tum.

                    Arguing with an Atheist is like arguing with a non living thing.

                    Why I said that? GAL has ignored all logics (even those comments where any ‘neutral person’ can say that he’s wrong).

                    I considered this matter closed since I NEVER quoted you in the first place. It is DIFFICULT for people like you, but try to mind your own business.

                    Before doing ‘naseehatain’ learn ethics.
                    Peace!

                    • Shahid Saleem

                      When you said “Arguing with an Atheist is like arguing with a non living thing.” you were calling him an atheist. That is what I mean by insult.

                      And regardless of whether you replied to GAL with or without quoting him, you are posting publicly and anyone can post comments here, even replies. That is the nature of internet interactions. If
                      you sent a private message to GAL and I somehow intercepted it and
                      replied, that would be one thing. If you were sitting in a restaurant
                      with GAL and talking with him and I (not sitting at your table)
                      interrupt and start talking about your conversation with GAL, that is
                      one thing. But this is not in any way private or personal conversation. And that is not what happens on Twitter, on Facebook, on blog comments, etc: they are not private. Anyone can read, anyone (depending on post permissions) can reply.

                      If you think it is a matter of ethics, I would simply say, who defines the ethics in this case, how did you come up with YOUR idea of what ethics are in online conversations, and how do you show that YOUR idea of ethics is the right one? The definition of ethics, mind you, is “moral principles that govern a person’s behavior or the conducting of an activity.” Moral has to do with “principles of right and wrong behavior”

                      Man, it’s as if you never outgrew the “who are you to butt into this conversation this isn’t concerning you at all” stage when you joined internet.

                    • Muhammed Ovais Alam

                      Like I said earlier:
                      Intehai farigh admi ho tum

                      * Ab ye mat post karna 1000 words pe k dunia k liay tumhari kitni khidmaat hain

                    • Shahid Saleem

                      Sorry, dude. You fail at internet communication.

                      For example, on twitter if someone replies to someone else, and a third party joins in, no one gets mad at the third party for getting involved. it’s simple how conversations work on public platforms online.

                    • Muhammed Ovais Alam

                      You fail at internet communication.

                      I don’t NEED a certification from libtard about that. Enjoy living in your bubble dream.

                    • Shahid Saleem

                      I don’t remember you being upset when someone posted about Torah and you replied asking for verse and I replied giving you the verse.

                      The same thing happened here, and yet you’re flying off the handle. Same conversation flow. Same public forum.

                      You really should work on your introspection skills.

                    • Muhammed Ovais Alam

                      O farigh admi bas karle.
                      Have a glass of cold water and take a deep breath.

      • Fozia_Loves_Abdul_Wahab

        they are poorest of the poor kids and fed and taught by madrissa system. but they are exploited by ur elites and then thrown away like garbage and declared terrorist.

        • Geek At Large

          Madarsas should be regulated.

          • Salman Akram

            Shukar ha ghatiya insaan tu ne bhi koi aqal wali baat ki…Just tell me how many champions have these universities have produced so far that World is in shock to see the progress being made solely due to those champions. Whenever your stupid rulers need Mujahids they are praising Mudrassah even your so called liberal civil society too. And when you sick people get what you wanted, then some dogs like you are hired to run a propaganda against Mudarassahs…

            • Geek At Large

              Nope. Liberals have never celebrated Mujahids. They called them out during Zia era when Pakistan decided to fight proxy war with Russia.

              I am a hired dog because I’ve a different opinion than yours? Why do you people get so angry?

              • Salman Akram

                Yes we get angry because you are just talking bullshit.. Because you have never been to the other side of the picture moron!!

          • Salman Akram

            And yes they are contributing to country and its cause by educating people the Islam…But some dumb people like you who have never visited mudrassah are online just to show the people that you are miserable …

            • Geek At Large

              I’ve been to a madarsah. I’m a hafiz. I speak from experience.

              • Talal

                No hafiz acts like you. Learning 2 or 4 surahs do not make you a “hafiz”

                • Geek At Large

                  I memorized all 114 surahs and 30 chapters (parahs). I don’t have a religion anymore though.

                  • Salman Akram

                    So if you don’t have religion anymore why does Mudrassahs still stuck in your ass?

                  • Talal

                    Allah jisey chahey gumrah kar de aur jise chahe hidayat de dey.

                    Tera quran ratney ka koi faida nhi tha. Tu abbu ko bol deta molvi se teri nhi banti. Ya molvi tere saath kuch karta tha tab bhi bta deta.

                    Ek molvi ki wajha se tu ne sab ko ek line main khara kar diya

                    • Geek At Large

                      Well filhaal to Allah ne mujhy gumrah kia hua hay.

                      “Tera quran ratney ka koi faida nhi tha.” I agree with that.

                      Not because of one molvi. This culture can be observed throughout the chains of madarsahs. Many students get involved in homosexuality because of sexually repressed environment and ignorance. And their Islamic education doesn’t prepare them to be a productive citizen of a country.

                    • Talal

                      So you got raped by a molvi and you have developed this mindset that all molvis are pedophiles rapists. Good job dum dum

                    • Geek At Large

                      Where did I say all molvis are pedophiles? Kindly don’t put words into my mouth.

                      My original point, which you clearly missed, was that madarsahs don’t prepare students for modern day world. They turn them into extremists dysfunctional citizens for whom it’s very difficult to add anything to our society.

                    • Talal

                      Modern day world? Stop believing in fairytales of nasa and aliens. You are never going to populate moon or mars.

                      Next world war and everything will go back to stone age. Your modern day world is a mirage and nothing more.

                    • Geek At Large

                      “Stop believing in fairytales of nasa and aliens.”

                      Should I believe in that Mohammad PBUH sat on a winged horse and paid a visit to heavens and god? Or where Moses carried millions of species in his small boat during the flood? It’s pretty obvious who wants people to believe in fairytales. It’s not science, it’s religion.

                      “You are never going to populate moon or mars.”

                      How do you know that?

                      “Next world war and everything will go back to stone age.”

                      Now you’re just relying on pure speculation since you’ve ran out of sane arguments.

                      “Your modern day world is a mirage and nothing more.”

                      My modern day world is a reason why we’re communicating right now. It’s a reality that’s happening.

                    • Talal

                      On one side you say you are a deist which means you do believe that someone created this world and then you question his powers by saying that his messenger could not ride winged horse and paid visit to heavens.

                      Moon landing was one of the biggest hoaxes of recent human history. Even hollywood now makes fun of fraud moon landing. No one ever went to moon and no one ever will. Van Allen belt is the limit.

                      So you think all these deadly weapons are made to be dumped in ocean or displayed in museum? These are made for destruction and depopulation of world.

                      Mirage lasts for certain times and then it goes away. https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/3efe6d423490ae8cc6d86a443ecde899d906ab048eb76cbb69c6890cc29b46de.jpg

                    • Geek At Large

                      Yeah because god and religion are two very different things.

                      Moon actually has photo reflectors on it installed by manned mission Apollo in 1967. You can carry out an experiment with a powerful laser to verify the presence of these photo reflectors.

                      All major countries are actually reducing their nuclear stockpiles. Check out the article published today on propakistani.

                    • Talal

                      Indeed a sheeple. Moon is not millions of miles away that you can’t see those reflectors with telescope. Even nikon p900 with 83x optical zoom is enough to zoom into the craters of moon “millions” of miles away. Moon is closer than your thoughts. https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/bffd99741e1cb25f69034c0235c6d187d6f923a6a8d56f483bf15b3ac4fa3cdc.jpg

                    • Geek At Large

                      Moon is around 400,000 km away from Earth. No camera or telescope can resolve such detail. Craters that these cameras can zoom into are 50-100 miles big. Photo reflectors are small devices. Few feet in dimension at max. Read about Lunar Laser Ranging Experiment.

                      And that’s not how optics works, please don’t repeat this on any forum. This is just embarrassing. Your knowledge of science is mediocre.

                    • Talal

                      Listen sheeple, you can not zoom into 50 miles large craters on something which is “400,000 KM away” with just a 83x camera. The math does not add up. You believe the bullsh*t that NASA is preaching through text books and Media.
                      I have repeated this on several forums and people with senses agreed with me.
                      https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/252cd2557f4c206697f2bd23dfe25b9cf7df8ffe31ed3fc9a2f4650fbc93f72f.jpg

                    • Ibn Sina

                      Apne agle reply mein humein zara proof dekhaaein is mathematics ka please which shows this doesn’t add up (sirf proof mang rahi hun, personal attack nhi).

                    • Talal

                      Ji Maryam, 83x nikon p900 se ap Lahore se sheikhpura bhi nhi dekh sakti jo 45 km dour hey. Jab k yahan moon k craters bhi clear dekhe ja sakte hain.
                      Len, saturn ki picture jo 1.2 billion kilometers dour hey. picture nikon p900 se li gai hey.
                      https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/fa92672e6fe2d8f166415047f12922dd084defb9551f1c4a749a74365cda6b63.jpg

                    • Talal
                    • Shahid Saleem

                      HA HA HA HA

                      WHO TOOK THIS PICTURE

                      HA HA HA HA

                      You know that there are TWO PARTS to the lunar projects. one stayed in orbit around moon. Other actually landed on moon.

                      That is why there were THREE ASTRONAUTS in Neil Armstrong’s mission and only two were in the lunar lander third was in orbiter.

                      You know nothing, lazy sapper.

                    • Talal

                      Neil Armstrong landed on moon in this tent made from tin foil and cloth.
                      https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/22e6435654c83d444b3196e6ae16839f18211d1d67972278f39e34800dadcc0e.jpg

                    • Shahid Saleem

                      poor deluded sapper. i sometimes forget that for ignorant people like you it is extra hard to produce something of value. the world must be a frightening place for you.

                      don’t worry, talal. pak army will defend you.

                    • Talal
                    • Shahid Saleem

                      must have been a millat tractor, i hear they work everywhere!

                    • Talal

                      Talking primate, tell me more about your evolution from monkeys.

                    • Shahid Saleem

                      more evidence of your ignorance. maybe you should read up on evolution a bit. only people who have not read even the cursory science about it think man evolved from apes.

                      did you evolve from apks? lol

                    • Talal

                      so man evolved from dinosaurs?
                      Or may be an alien f*cked and impregnated a monkey and your ancestors were born?

                    • Shahid Saleem

                      Fascinating! A new theory emerged from the ignorant one.

                    • Talal

                      post your theory how man evolved.

                    • Shahid Saleem

                      I am not a scientist, I can only read what scientists have come up with. The best theory now is that man and apes have a common ancestor. google for “evolution missing link”.

                      No one rational or knowledgable claims man evolved from apes. Anyone who claims that is easy to dismiss as ignorant.

                      which
                      you
                      have
                      demonstrated
                      to
                      be.

                      (repeatedly)

                    • Talal

                      science says man, monkeys and similar other primates had common “ape” like ancestor. Read again. I say, If we did evolve slowly from something where are those inter-species? What happened to them?
                      No wonder, d*mb people like you believe any non-sense fed to them

                      I AM A HUMAN, MY ANCESTORS WERE HUMANS. FIRST MAN ADAM WAS HUMAN AND A SPECIAL CREATION.

                      Now write your family chain d*mbing down to some ape like ancestor.

                    • Shahid Saleem

                      It says common ancestor, not common ape. Cite your sources.

                    • Talal

                      Common ancestor not common ape? You mean that “s*cum” (archaea) from which all species on earth evolved? HUHU

                      read about ‘”chimpanzee-human last common ancestor” on wikipedia or somewhere else because propakistani does not allow posting links anymore.

                      Besides, why do you keep insisting you evolved from something? God, why can’t you just admit that humans are unique creation. Why do you keep insisting you are no better than monkeys?

                    • Shahid Saleem

                      “However, to date no fossil has been identified as a probable candidate for the CHLCA”

                      It’s a theory. like I said, best theory today. Science can only talk about theories.

                      Besides, next you’ll tell us that DNA testing is as fake as moon landing LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL

                    • Talal

                      Why would I? DNA finger print is as much real as I am.

                    • Shahid Saleem

                      So the fact that ape DNA is similar to human DNA you deny, but DNA fingerprint you don’t? HMMMM

                    • Talal

                      Chimpanzee must look like you and your dad, so can I declare you are chimpanzee inbred? Now, don’t go crazy.

                    • Shahid Saleem

                      Why, no, it is an honour in itself to be talked about by a fake moon landing ignorant person. Why would I go crazy? Quite the opposite!

                    • Shahid Saleem

                      I didn’t bring up topic of evolution…

                    • Salman Akram

                      Yeah and the universities are also preparing the rapists so that they can be functional citizens of society… And BTW Saad Aziz, Hafiz Nasir, Azhar Ishrat of Safoora attack all of them were graduates from universities and functional citizens of the society…

                    • Geek At Large

                      Saad Aziz was also radicalized by Jamat-e-Islami and he later went on to join Al-Qaida. I’m sorry to burst your bubble but again it was the extremist mullahs who were at fault.

                    • Salman Akram

                      Do you have a single proof for your statement that he was radicalized by JI??? Please note that media news statements are not proofs if you are gonna mention that as your proof keep it to yourself… Sorry to burst your small bubble baby.. I am really enjoying it when you try to present a distorted logic and someone on the other side fucks you right with your own logic

                    • Geek At Large

                      Yes, his friend Ali Rehman actually introduced him to JI guys. And I’d suggest you read his confession.

                      I don’t think you’re enjoying. You seem very angry to me.

                    • Salman Akram

                      Beta lgta ha mera comment ghaur se nhi parha.. “No media news statements” Have you heard him recording his statement?
                      Beta abhi new ho seekh jao gy.. Statement tau Mr. Ishaq Dar ne bhi record krwai thi money laundering ki but now he is refusing it.. So no media news statements actual proof ha tau plzz ya ye keh do k you were present there when he was recording his statement

                    • Geek At Large

                      You don’t rely on Dawn News?

                    • Salman Akram

                      Why should I rely on dawn news? They reported that there was some kind of tensions between government and army. But the other parties tell a completely different story.. So media uses its journalistic powers to manipulate the society.. You are made to believe in certain things while they didn’t even exist.. Just like J.W. Bush used media to get people agree with him so that he can attack Iraq to destroy the Weapons of Mass Destruction… But in the end there were no WMD..

                    • Salman Akram

                      So you are saying that whatever the media is reporting is 100% truth? Dawn news reported a tension between government and army a few months back but the subjects are denying it completely. So who would you believe? I work for an OMC, a few months Express news was reporting that Oil reserves have come to the lowest point and oil shortage throughout the country going to happen. I was really in shock to read that because we had not anything like that in here. Operations were running smooth.. And last week DAWN news reported that oil crisis is coming due to Circular debt as 12-15 oil tankers are at Outer Anchorage and the industry does not have money. Wait WHAT??? There are at least 10 OMCs operating in the country and the Oil tankers that are handled at port averages at 28-30 tankers per month. And it is completely normal that 12-15 tankers are at outer anchorage. So should I believe DAWN news?? So what am I saying that media is the tool being used by the POWERFUL to manipulate the majority either for his own sake or for some other purposes. I believe you know how J.W. Bush get the public opinion in his favour for attacking the IRAQ.(Weapons of Mass Destruction). In the end a report (Not media report) after 15 years tells the truth that there were no WMDs in IRAQ…

                    • Geek At Large

                      To be honest, this long and angry rant about media pretty much disqualifies you from having a rational discussion.

                      Throughout the thread you’ve relied more on ad hominem than actual rational arguments. May be you’ve a more reliable source of information than mainstream media which you rely on. Share that source with the rest of us for the sake of better informed humanity. I’m sorry but I’d rather rely on dawn news instead of your conspiracy theories.

                      Let’s have a debate when you’re not emotional and angry.

                    • Salman Akram

                      Wah bhai wah agr me media par blind trust nhi krta tau m rational discussion nhi kr skta… Wahh wahhh wahhh… Taliyaaan bhai log kya logic pesj ki ha munnay ne… Yr teri shakal dkhny ko dil kr rha ha k dkhon srf baaton se he pagal lgta ha ya shakal b aisi he ha…

                    • Shahid Saleem

                      don’t hold back. tell us what you would like to do to “fix” Geek’s viewpoint.

                    • Salman Akram

                      I don’t consider it a point simply..

                    • Salman Akram

                      O bhai mene bhi kch arz kiya tha universities k bary me… Uska reply krty huay tklf hoti ha kya? Ya such krwa bhttt ha??

              • Salman Akram

                So if you had a bad experience then you cannot make a single straight out opinion against all the Madrassahs.. There have been raping cases in sone of universities so should I make an opinion that all the universities are producing rapist??? WTF kind of logic is that???

                • Geek At Large

                  I’m not generalizing. Violence and expectation of unconditional obedience in madarsahs is a prevalent problem throughout the chains. Besides, complete lack of modern education produces dysfunctional citizens who can only recite Quran or hand out fatwas.

                  By the way, Pakistani universities aren’t any great either at imparting education except a few elite institutions that are unaffordable for majority of Pakistanis.

                  • Salman Akram

                    Yes some of the legends created by universities like Aitzaz Ahsan, Rehman Malik are also dysfunctional citizen just like you because they can’t even recite a single small surah.. So what greatness universities are pouring into mankind??? And why are you so much into this World while you know you have to die to get up in the after world… Ohhh sorry I forgot.. You have no religion and how could you believe in that.. And yes you are generalizing it moron whether you accept it or not.. Remember if someone at Suffah Islamic School has fucked you don’t blame others for that..

                    • Talal

                      He believes he came from monkeys and the world came into existence from nothing, and it perfected itself.

                    • Geek At Large

                      As I said, nothing is perfect. Molvi hazraat tell you that because they themselves don’t know the imperfections.

                    • Geek At Large

                      All major discoveries and inventions have done by people who can’t recite Quran in last 200 years. You don’t need Islamic education to be a productive citizen. That’s simply the truth.

                      No, I am not generalizing.

                      I’m sorry but I don’t believe in god who burns people. The god I believe in very kind and if I’ve done any mistakes, I’m pretty sure he’ll forgive me.

                      Calling me a moron won’t make your argument any stronger.

                  • Salman Akram

                    And one more thing Islam do demands unconditional odedience not the Mudrassahs… And what would you say when your university professor tells you to get passing marks if you want to get ahead.. Have you ever got ahead without getting passing marks? Isn’t this unconditional obedience? Why can’t one get to the next grade if he has not passed the exams? Because every fucking reward demands unconditional obedience you idiot!!

                    • Geek At Large

                      That’s not unconditional obedience. It’s a criteria you’ve to meet to get a qualification.

                      You don’t get beaten up if you get less marks. You don’t get burned in hell forever for failing a university test.

                    • Geek At Large

                      That’s not unconditional obedience. That’s a criteria you’ve to meet to get a qualification. They’re not coerced or beaten up for disobeying.

                    • Salman Akram

                      So when the Mudrassah has that same criteria to get a qualification you name that Unconditional Obedience. WOWWWWW!!! Really do you have your mind intact or you lost it in the process of becoming Atheist??? First tune your standards then blame others for the wrong doing.

          • Raja G

            sukar hai apki tabyet theek hogae hai warna jawab mai dene laga tha apki chawal comment pe

      • Raja G

        Geeta At large – listen I have met various hafiz Quran they are not just Hafiz they are software developers and even performing exceptionally well in management role – kabhe gher say nikal lia kero – jo baat ime abu say pata chele ho us pe yaqeen na kia kero

        • Geek At Large

          I know Madarsah culture pretty well. I’ve studied in one for 6 years.

          • Salman Akram

            In which Madrassah have you been studying???

            • Geek At Large

              Al-Suffah Islamic School in Gulshan e Iqbal, Karachi.

          • Muhammed Ovais Alam

            You learned ‘culture’ of all Madarsas in just 6 years?
            Did you have that time travelling watch of Hermione with you?

      • Geek At Large

        Ok, sir.

      • Muhammed Ovais Alam

        And you showed again with your hate :)
        Are you using some kind of script?

      • FuriousNinja

        Also have batchmates who are Hafiz and ‘product’ of madrassah, and MashAllah they are doing MBBS now. This is the most hateful and biased comment I have read so far from you. Stop spreading hate please.

        • Shahid Saleem

          It is not hate if it’s true. How many madrassahs have been raided in the past 15 years? Are news reports with video of police finding weapons false?

          • Salman Akram

            Police have recovered weapons from hostels of universities also…Would you please enlighten us on this ???

            • Shahid Saleem

              oddly enough, they always find the weapons with students associated with political parties. to me it means that politics should stay out of our universities and colleges.

    • shiftew

      what kind of stupid logic are u using?? “madrasaas” are different thing.. their main goal is to provide kids with islamic teaching.. islamic teaching does not get updated every once in a while.. but education DOES ,there are new inventions happening every day.. it would take 60 years for the curriculum to catch up to todays learning about computers (because you can’t just skip everything in the between and move to most recent inventions) ..also more than 80% of population either speaks or understands urdu .. so what you bitching about? we should be worried about minority languages that are being cut and replaced by majority languages ..the main goal of NGO schools is to provide them with knowledge from outside world.. how are you going to gain knowledge about outside world when you don’t know their language ..STUPID

      • Raja G

        kid read my comment with deep analysis – dont write ki massi of muhala- how many kids in pakistan are getting education kid ? around 50 million kids are not getting education- why we worry about computer education when huge population is not even getting basic education – grow up idoit and get the facts – pata nae kahan say uth ke ajate hain

      • Raja G

        tu bahe tu inside out ke knowlege leta rehta hai stupid – Main goal of NGO is not to provide the knowlege ye pakistan mai kia chun chara rae hai sub jante hain –

  • Muhammad Ashraf

    Dear Author,

    Windows xp is still being in used by many major companies, there is nothing bad to teach students about windows xp,

    • Muhammad Kamran

      Most of Pakistan Bank ATM still use windows XP

      • Saqeef Iqbal

        That’s sadly the case with most of the world really.

      • shiftew

        which is very stupid.. because these companies are putting themselves at risk by using outdated software.. im assuming you have somewhat knowledge about the world.. not only does outdated software puts you at risk (as a company employee) but the customers who interact with you!!

    • Ammar

      I don’t know what major companies you’re talking about but the ones I’ve seen use Windows 7 at least. If any company is using Windows XP they’re probably using pirated copies.

      • Muhammad Ashraf

        it really expensive to change old system to new ones that’s why embedded systems, atm uses windows xp, let me remind you american nuclear program still using large size floppy disk for their intercontinental missile systems

        • Geek At Large

          The New Horizon probe that made it to Pluto used PlayStation 1 hardware. For extremely sensitive tasks, old hardware is used because of reliability. And what you’re alluding to are niches and specific cases. They don’t apply to general consumer technology.

          What hardware and OSs do companies like Microsoft, Google, Apple, Snapchat, Oracle, Yahoo! and likes use?

        • Ammar

          I’m not talking about embedded systems, I’m talking about general computers that companies use in their offices.

    • Saqeef Iqbal

      This ‘soch’ is absolutely toxic, this is not how a responsible nation nurtures its youth. By teaching it technology already considered very much obsolete now, much more so when the same child will be going to university or college. They don’t really have any use for floppy’s in college.

    • continuedhere

      XP is EOL so anyone still using it is opening themselves up to attack. All these companies are getting hacked and they will learn the hard way that they have to update.

    • Syed Zarar

      How does two wrong make a right?

    • shiftew

      which is very stupid.. because these companies are putting themselves at risk by using outdated software.. im assuming you have somewhat knowledge about the world.. not only does outdated software puts you at risk (as a company employee) but the customers who interact with you!! stupid logic sir

    • M. Ahmed

      Even US Army still uses XP.

      Navy pays Microsoft $9 million a year for Windows XP – Jun. 26, 2015 – CNN Money

  • Saqeef Iqbal

    The education system really is horrendous, I mean I look at my younger brothers computing book (he’s in 7th grade) and they’re teaching 7th graders how to use floppy disks! How to open a website in Netscape Navigator for god sakes! I’m 15, and I’m a self taught web developer and also develop android apps ( I’m basically into everything related to tech) and the mindset that’s being incurred into these kids minds is absolutely disastrous to not only these kids future but also of Pakistan’s future. They have absolutely no idea about coding or how a a computer fundamentally works! The future is in computing and I understand the general awaam’s approach to computing limiting it to Facebook and Instagram and WhatsApp, this ‘soch’ is disgusting. Kids in the developed world and even in india are being taught how to code in this age not his to insert goddamn floppy disks into ancient windows XP! BTW my younger brother is in Bahria college, managed by the Navy, can’t even believe what the situation would be like in government schools.

    • Raja G

      app tension nay lain sub theek hogae ga

  • Hunzala Ahmad

    Every govt high school have computer lab with updated systems and PC’s running windows 8 with net computing.
    The problem is the slybus which is outdated.
    Lots of ancient ages things are in 9th standard.
    And there is gw basic in 10 th standard which only works in windows xp.

  • Interconnect

    Thanks Mr Adil Iqbal for the important topic coverage. We have to look at the Microsoft Corporation Pakistan office a box pusher here in Pakistan. Microsoft use to have a lively offices here in Pakistan, but now only selling Windows 10. We forgot to teach Linux or the Open source to our kids. Windows 7 or such OS are still being taught in schools, and used in the ATM’s support. As the sector is not aware. And Microsoft box pusher want a premium for the upgrade. Our honorable Minister MOITT should consider this as the focal person on the Digital Divide please let Microsoft do something for a market which has blessings of the whole country.

  • Ahmed Habib

    The author was in so hurry to oppose government that his very first sentence having typo error!! Propakistani need to re-educate their authors first.

    • continuedhere

      Part of the problem is that educated people in Pakistan don’t write for the web. So it is left to the rest of us to do it. You lot need to step forward.

    • Iqbal

      Care to point out the typo cuz I dont see one?
      Achi bat chhor k keeray nikalnay beth jatay hain pakistani

      • Ahmed Habib

        Because they have fixed it already… You sleepy idiot.

  • Imran Hussain

    Even Virtual University that claims “Pakistan’s first University based completely on modern Information and Communication Technologies” is still using Windows XP (at least in Multan Campus).

  • Sohaib Razzaq

    Today’s kids know nothing about operating systems. Windows has become so simplified that you need no understanding of how things work, with the arrival of smartphones and touch it has become even worse. Sure you can open facebook with a click and use whatsapp but technology wise you get 0% understanding of whats happening in background.

    I had an opportunity of using IBM 286 PC my father had back in 92 when i was 6-7 year old, working on DOS, making batch files so i don’t have to type 3-4 commands just to navigate to a folder so i can play Graham gooch cricket on it did taught me a lot, far more then any children can learn these days which finally made me learn programming.

    You learn nothing from windows be it Win XP or Win 10. Its all clicking

    • continuedhere

      Lay persons are not supposed to master IT. They just need to know enough to get their job done. Those who specialize in IT are a different matter entirely. But for your average student being able to use the most popular OS (Windows 10) and common productivity apps is enough.

      • Raja G

        why not we are interested to teach kids Linux – why we are all weeping for windows and windows only ?

  • continuedhere

    In the IT field Pakistan is the most backward of all south asian countries save for Afghanistan. The problem is not so much the schools or the government. It’s the people. They just don’t take technology seriously. It’s all a big joke to them. The influence of religion and mullahs who preach it is one of the main reasons behind this backwardness. The have made the internet out to be the most evil thing there is.

    • Raja G

      bhae tun tu nae hogia kia behki bheki batain suru ker dain

  • Geek At Large

    A local computer shop in my area still markets and sells Pentium 4 which is like decade and a half old. Most people have no idea about technology. They were relatively more informed when Intel was using Pentium branding as it was easier to keep track of like iPhone. The higher the number the better the product. Since the inception of Core series, people have lost track of it.

    • continuedhere

      Pakistan imports a lot of used PCs from the west. There are both upsides and downsides to this. The upside is that if you know what you are doing you can get a pretty nice rig for cheap. 2nd and 3rd gen core i’s can be had for 9-11k which is very pretty good deal. Newer generations haven’t gotten much faster. It’s only now that AMD is competitive with Ryzen so hopefully intel will up their game.

      Of course you are right that P4s and core2duos are obsolete and not worth buying. The import of junk like that is the downside.

      • Shahid Saleem

        Newer generations are actually a lot faster! You can find comparisons online.

        geekbench:

        Intel Core i5-3470T = 6056 (from 2012, 3rd generation)
        Intel Core i5-4460T= 9854 (from 2014, 4th genereation)

        you can also compare 2nd gen vs 5th or 6th to see even bigger improvement. pretty much you are throwing money away if yoy get anything older than 4th gen

  • burhan

    Why not start using/teaching open source software(Linux, Libre office,). Would cost less, technically more advanced, equally useful for a common user, business purposes and developers. Sadly, students get taste of Linux in bachelors program. And that too, for the formality.

    • Raja G

      exactly this is the best comment i found- windows can be learned by any kid – even in Pakistan 6 year kid is doing MCSE using ratalogy of Dumps- windows is seriously a joke no one need to learn anything from windows – we should move towards linux if we really want to teach kids something difficult and challenging but worth while in years to come- like android emulators and Virtual platform for andriod application development and gaming –

  • Unity Sacarecrow

    There is nothing wrong int that. I am a CS graduate and I think they should also teach DOS. Because the main changes from DOS to Windows 10 are in interface and UX. Latest versions are more and more simplified and user does not know how things are working but if you want to study them, you need to go to the basics.

    • College

      Agree 100%

      The people talking above know little about how OS works they just buy Rs 40 Windows pirated DVD and think they are experts after installing pirated OS

      We need computer literate generation and Old PCs and XP etc is serving the purpose

      Student/Schools can’t afford expensive new machines

      • Raja G

        then move to linux use portable linux – ubuntu – redhat linux and there are hundered of free bootable Linux CD ISO are avialable just download them burn on CD or use Virtual PC or VM ware to boot them inisde the pc enjoy learning

      • FuriousNinja

        After 10 years they ll still be using this legacy windows. Where will you be then? Still stating the same? Atleast our Education sector should try to move with time, not backwards.

        • College

          After 10 years you may be able to understand what I have stated!

          Digital divide can be narrowed down with cheap and affordable, may be LEGACY devices/OS

          • FuriousNinja

            You keep stating cheap and affordable and use this line of fact as your defense. Mate, a used branded system with a Core 2 Duo processor and around 2GB ram which costs barely Rs3000-4000 can adequately run a copy of Windows 7/8.1 and even 10 easily. So how exactly is this expensive? I have seen computers equipped with much better hardware in schools and colleges but still running same old Windows XP. It’s about time we move ahead and no, we cant teach anything using the old technology. I don’t know what sort of logic you guys are presenting with the statement ‘Better to teach old Windows because it is sophisticated and much more difficult than the new one because it is much more easier?’ A guy who has learned some basic functions on an older operating system wouldn’t be able to do anything when presented with a newer one.

    • Raja G

      now DOS is replaced by Powershell- this is the era of Powershell – even ransomwhere malware is spread through word files using powershell – why not we start learning and teaching powershell if we are really concerned about security and windows –

      • Unity Sacarecrow

        Because powershell is not a complete OS while DOS is.

        • Raja G

          DOS can taught as OS but Powershell is huge thing – its used as weapon as well cure for automation and various Windows and office products functions

    • Shahid Saleem

      But actually the difference between DOS and a real operating system are MAJOR and HUGE. Very different. Being good at DOS does not mean you learn much more than some commands used in cmd terminal window. And a lot of configuration and stuff in newer windows is all GUI.

      • Unity Sacarecrow

        Well, that is a problem only if you want to teach, “How to operate an operating system.” But purpose here is “how an operating system works, how it communicates with hardware etc. And I cannot think of any better and simpler operating system for this purpose than DOS.

  • Shaykh ul Islam Tahir ul Qadri

    Or Pakistan ki har university linux ko ubuntu bna k parhati hai….

    • anonymous

      I am using kali linux and I learned a lot.Recently I hacked my neighbour’s wifi and I know how linux works.I can inject payloads and hack facebook,twitter etc.We need to teach our generation python,ruby,perl,java and other languages.I also repair my computer and I solve different problems of PCs.I can hack all user passwords in my university.I can block internet connection using linux.
      Even people don’t know how to install windows.

      • Nab

        hey mister, then hack Mark Zuckerberg’s facebook ID, can you ?

    • Raja G

      khuda ka nam lay mere bahe

  • Muhammad Qasim Naeem

    I am also shocked to see mcc(madina cash & carry) in G9 Islamabad they are also using windows xp for cash counting

  • sudo apt-get update

  • FT

    Windows 10/8.1/8 are utter shit. Useless operating systems for dumb adolescent users. Bug-ridden and inelegant. Windows XP/7 FTW!!!

    Teaching concepts rather than environment itself is more important.

  • Muhammad Salahudin

    This comment section is a total mess.
    Sorry for offtophic comment admin.
    My thoughts on rights for women disscussion.
    I agree with both talal and mariam.
    If a girl wants to run off with her bf then so be it. She is allowed to do that.All she has to do is to be prepared for her upcoming son or daughter to do the same one day.
    As for as they say “maa baap ki farmabrdaar batiyan” they should hope for obedient sons and daughters. In short, east is east , west is west , and never the twain shall meet. That is again my opinion. Thats all.

  • Shakeel Ahmed

    Jnb-e-Awlaa,
    ap logo’n ny matric ki computer ki book nahi parhi honi, I guess.
    and for I.C.S., its totally dump as well,
    9th class’s course include History of Computer, Wow, “now our students need to learn History in Computer Class”,
    Input/Output devices, who kid don’t know it?
    2nd last chap, Introduction to Windows, holy crap,
    Windows XP,
    how to control pointer, deleting/making/renaming a folder,
    Wow, great…

    In 10th class, a language named GW-Basic, which was turned down by US in 1980s, is still being taught.

    First year is the mirror image of 9th class,

    2nd year is little bit well,
    but Computer’s course should be improved asap (this session/next).

    My teacher’s teacher studied same course and my teacher taught me after 4 years of break, me too studied same course.
    and now I’m teaching same after 7-years of break.
    Crap Clap,

    • FuriousNinja

      Exactly.

  • Muhammed Ovais Alam

    Salam to the sleeping Mods of ProPak for allowing (not deleting) extremely offensive and abusing comments about Prophet (SAWW).
    Your website should be reported too.
    Traffic k liay aur kitna neechay giro ge ab?

    • Shahid Saleem

      maybe you can report to IHC LOL

      • Muhammed Ovais Alam

        Bohat baray troll ho.
        Har jagah koodna zaroori nahi hai tumhara.

  • Shahid Saleem

    government needs to do this, government needs to do that. and the same people who feel like this also cry when withholding taxes are applied to non-filers.

  • Faheem Ahmed

    and about 99% institutes use windows xp and office 2007 or 2010… so sad….while they be using…office 2016 and windows 10

  • Waqas Ahmed

    Haah! You’re saying schools? Come and visit GC Gujranwala. Current BS IT course outlines are fossils which the students have to read at any cost to obtain scores. Major thing is, outline states that students must know the latest WINDOWS XP AND ITS USES AND WINDOWS SERVER 2003 installation and its uses.